2017-04-25 at 12:20 #6781
Hi, I am editing a feature documentary right now and will be doing the Color for it as well, and will be doing more Color work in the near future. I have colored other projects for web and international broadcast, but I recently learned about DisplayCal and I’m trying to rethink my calibration methods. My methods have worked for me so far and no one has complained about weird color shifting or anything, but I always delivered ProRes files and not DCP’s or anything, so I don’t know if they applied some color science afterwards for the broadcast stuff. Here is what my previous setup was:
Windows 7 – Nvidia Quadro K5200 – Dell U2410 (10 bit IPS) – Spyder 4 Elite – and my calibration process in the past was just to calibrate in the Spyder software, and I tried several different presets and all gave fairly similar results, and I was pleased with the colors.
A few days ago I started doing some research into calibration for DCI-P3 for this film I’m on and uncovered a slew of things which caused more questions than answers. But on my quest I learned of DisplayCal and decided to switch to this for my calibration. I’ve tried 3 calibrations so far with different settings and they give me very different results and so I feel the need to ask what the best settings are for me and my needs.
Things I need: I need to be able to color for projects for film, broadcast, and web; I’m happy to do new calibrations in between if I have to, but I need to know what I’m doing. I would ideally like the monitor to be calibrated to the proper color science, because some projects have me color in Premiere, some in Speedgrade, some in Resolve, and I also do Photoshop work (which I know is different, but still want accurate colors), but I’d also like to know the process for bringing the LUTs into these programs if that’s the only way to achieve the correct color space.
My questions are as follows:
- Considering a film needs to be displayed on DCI-P3 projector, but also needs to look good for web, dvd, and potential broadcast; should I try to calibrate my monitor to a DCI-P3 colorspace and work that way? Or should I work in a default Gamma 2.2 or maybe Rec 709 to get the colors where I want them, then use something like cuteDCP or easyDCP to export the DCP into a DCI-P3 colorspace? I’ve never had to create DCP’s before and I want to make sure they are as accurate as possible and I know we don’t have time to rent a theater and check the colors on a proper projector.
2. Sorry if this question isn’t quite meant for the DisplayCal community, but I might as well ask. What is the best workflow for how I should calibrate my monitor and colorspaces to work (and or LUTs to use) to get the most accuracy with final output to Film (DCI-P3)? Broadcast (Rec 709)? And Web?
3. When I did my first calibration I selected the Rec 709 tone curve thinking it would give me the closest approximation to Rec 709, and when it was done I noticed severely muted colors and decreased contrast compared to my other monitor which was previously a pretty good match (I also tried the 3DLUT for Resolve Setting but selected my monitor instead of Resolve, and the result is a bit better, but still seems wrong). And if I graded something to look natural and took it to any other monitor the image had way too much saturation and contrast because I was trying to compensate to get a natural look. Is that what Broadcast Rec 709 is expecting, an image that would look blown out and over done on a regular monitor? Or have I misunderstood the point of the tone curve and it should be used for something different? If so, how do I achieve the correct color space for Broadcast or Film for that matter (similar to my above question)?
4. I realize I have lots of questions that somewhat overlap, but I really want to learn about this and understand everything so I’m not guessing when I’m coloring, especially for the feature film I’m working on. But in addition to wanting to know the workflow, my final question is given that workflow, what are the settings you recommend for me to set for my DisplayCal, in terms of the Settings Tab, Instrument Mode, White Point, White Level, Tone Curve, etc, etc?
I really appreciate any and all help and advice.
Thank you2017-04-26 at 20:21 #6799
Considering a film needs to be displayed on DCI-P3 projector, but also needs to look good for web, dvd, and potential broadcast; should I try to calibrate my monitor to a DCI-P3 colorspace and work that way?
While the U2410 covers a good portion of P3, there’s also some parts it doesn’t – so it’s probably safer to target Rec. 709.
What is the best workflow for how I should calibrate my monitor and colorspaces to work (and or LUTs to use) to get the most accuracy with final output to Film (DCI-P3)? Broadcast (Rec 709)? And Web?
If you have the possibility to use a 3D LUT, that’s the way to go. There’s various 3D LUT presets for Rec 709 with BT.1886 tone curve in DisplayCAL that only differ by the default pattern generator used and 3D LUT format they produce, so pick one of those that suits your workflow.
When I did my first calibration I selected the Rec 709 tone curve thinking it would give me the closest approximation to Rec 709, and when it was done I noticed severely muted colors and decreased contrast
The Rec. 709 tone curve should not be used, the correct tone curve for the Rec. 709 gamut is BT.1886. The Rec. 709 curve is an encoding-only curve, it exists as a calibration choice only for legacy reasons, and even if it were to be used, it should only be used together with an ambient light adjustment for the viewing environment. But the standard is BT.1886, so ignore the Rec. 709 curve entirely.
Note that the BT.1886 standard curve will differ from display to display depending on contrast ratio, so for the best match between multiple displays that are viewed together, they should all be calibrated to the same black- and white level if possible. For grade 1 displays, a black level of below 0.05 and a white level of 70-100 cd/m2 is required by the EBU, resulting in above 1400:1 contrast ratio. The U2410 won’t be able to quite reach that, it’ll be closer to around 700:1 (at 6500K), putting it in EBU grade 2 monitor territory, so results will look lighter than on a display with higher contrast. But the BT.1886 curve will maintain perceptually relatively even contrast steps.
what are the settings you recommend for me to set for my DisplayCal, in terms of the Settings Tab, Instrument Mode, White Point, White Level, Tone Curve, etc, etc?
If you’re going to use a 3D LUT, pick one of the 3D LUT presets as mentioned above (and profile the monitor in its widest gamut mode). Otherwise, pick the “Video (D65, Rec. 1886)” preset (note that you then need to use ICC color managed software for gamut correction, which many video suites do not support, or profile the monitor in sRGB mode). Set colorimeter correction to “Spectral: LCD CCFL Wide Gamut”.2017-04-26 at 20:48 #6801
Thank you so much for the response. I’ll re calibrate tonight with the Video (D65, Rec. 1886) preset. I’ve been using the Custom preset on my monitor to adjust RGB gain values for the initial White Point test, which I believe is also giving me the widest gamut.
You mentioned the contrast ratio, and brightness levels. My Spyder software previously had me set to 150cd/m2 because my workspace does have a bit of light, so I had done the same with DisplayCal since it didn’t make a recommendation for me. I’ve heard others say 120cd/m2 is the best brightness to work with. Would you suggest I crank up the contrast setting on my monitor (to get closer to the 1400:1) and lower brightness to 100cd/m2?
I’m sorry for sounding dumb, but what did you mean by using an ICC color managed software? Do you mean a software like Resolve that allows me to input a LUT? Or something to manage the monitor for general use? Because while I do want the best results and will generate 3D LUTs to use in Resolve, I also need the monitor as accurate as possible for work in Premiere, as some clients want Color to be done in Premiere.
I really appreciate the help. Thank you.2017-04-28 at 1:25 #6818
My Spyder software previously had me set to 150cd/m2 because my workspace does have a bit of light, so I had done the same with DisplayCal since it didn’t make a recommendation for me. I’ve heard others say 120cd/m2 is the best brightness to work with.
There is no such thing as universal “best” brightness – it depends on the environment. The monitor should neither be too dim nor too bright, so that eye strain is minimized. 120 cd/m2 is a reasonable target for a relatively dimly lit room.
Would you suggest I crank up the contrast setting on my monitor (to get closer to the 1400:1)
On most digitally connected LCD computer monitors, the “contrast” control should be left alone (at factory defaults). These displays have a fixed contrast ratio that is determined by the backlight, so in most cases it is only possible to reduce, not increase, contrast by adjusting the “contrast” control, and doing otherwise may introduce clipping.
I’m sorry for sounding dumb, but what did you mean by using an ICC color managed software?
Something like (e.g.) Photoshop. In the video world, ICC support is somewhat sparse and even if it’s available in some cases, it may not be fully implemented, so I would rely on 3D LUTs instead (where possible – I think Premiere isn’t capable to color manage at all).2017-04-28 at 11:18 #6832
Thank you so much for your help. I recalibrated with your suggested settings and everything feels so much better. I really appreciate it.2019-03-20 at 15:51 #16424
Glad I found this thread! I have a monitor that has Standard, AdobeRGB, SRGB, DCI-P3, Rec. 709, D50, D65. When using DisplayCal, should I leave this on (I’m assuming) Rec. 709? Or is another setting better for web delivery?
Thanks!2019-03-21 at 18:42 #16441
Depends on your workflow. What operating system are you on and which program(s) do you intend to use for content creation?2021-03-26 at 15:00 #29426
Hi, I have the same question… I´m on a Windows 10, and work mostly with video editing on PremierePro/AE and Da Vinci Resolve (which I use both ways: on the “controls screen” – for fast color correction – and on a dedicated monitor through BlackMagic Mini Monitor, with a custom 3D LUT for more accurate work).
What those presets really do? My Benq SW270c has “Color Modes” with predefined presets ( AdobeRGB, sRGB, BW, DCI-P3, rec 709, Display P3, HDR…) that limit my choices on “Color Gamut”,” Color Temperature” and “Gamma” menus.
But when I choose “Custom”, it unlocks all choices. My monitor is said to be 99% Adobe RGB and 97% DCI-P3, and My “Color Gamut” menu has AdobeRGB, sRGB, Rec 709 and DCI-P3. Should I go with the largest gamut Adobe RGB to reflect my monitor “native”, and so DisplayCal can “see everything” ?
What about gamma? Should I pick my target gamma to match with DisplayCal target? (My display offers 1.6, 1.8, 2.0, 2.2, 2.4, 2.6 and sRGB).
Thanks in advance! (for everything, really…)2021-03-26 at 17:16 #29434
When creating profiles you want to use custom mode and any other settings that unlock the full gamut of the display. You can use DisplayCal verification report to check. Choose default gamma, that should use the least internal processing. If the default value is unknown do a factory reset.2021-03-28 at 5:35 #29450
Thanks a lot, that clarified a lot my doubts. So I guess that after calibration, if I choose some other Color Gamut on the monitor screen I´m kind of limiting my native one. And that´s an “external” way of doing it, other than the conversion apps already do, targeting ou media properties and programs preferences…2021-03-28 at 12:08 #29451
And that´s an “external” way of doing it,
That’s a matter of perspective I guess. Either way, the standard color managed apps apply corrections in a higher bit depth. Also exposing the full gamut increases profiling accuracy, assuming the matching correction has been chosen for your displays backlight.2021-03-29 at 10:06 #29456
Check contrast on that SW270C, all independent reports show extremely poor contrast (600:1).
A 300euro sRGB 27″QHD display will be twice better for video that those trash SW models. You jumped in the wrong boat.