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To me, this clearly indicates that the SpyderX cannot accurately determine the white point and should be discarded. However, if I am indeed doing something incorrectly, please enlighten me!
Till you buy an i1d3 from Xrite/Calibrite, or you rent an i1Pro family spectrophotometer to correct your Spyder*, use DisplayCAL “visual whitepoint editor”, or even better, since you have a “match to what it looks D65 to you” (display p3 mode, factory calibrated) use it as reference in visual white point… or just set those gains and set white point target “as measured”.
Photoshop won’t care about your display’s whitepoint so no issue there, but rememeber to do not use absolute colorimetric on that setup (with that “alternative whitepoint that your spyder measured not close to D65) to standard profiles with D65. You can use rel colorimetric for LUT3D (easy way) or abs colorimetric LUT3D to alternative profiles with your measured whitepoint.(*) your Spyder hardware may be not “very wrong”. No colorimeter matches std observer. SpyderX and newer is not “that bad”.
The issue here is there is only one built-in correction for all the LED widegamut flavors out there, and spyders are not able to use “distributed corrections” (CCSS), only custom ones (CCMX, matrix) that require an spectriphotometer or similar reference device.
i1d3 is a better hardware yes, but the key is that it accepts distributed corrections.SpyderX Pro on Amazon
Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.
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The Spyder X doesn’t support the FPS panel on your display, which is why the resulting white point appears visually off. It’s best not to rely on manufacturer specs or DeltaE “certification” values, as manufacturers themselves admit they come with no guarantees. Trust only the DeltaE values you’ve personally measured using a reliable measurement device.
I understand this now, but i need a okayish solution now and not in 6 month when i have enough money for a new colorimetri, or better for a spectrometer like a calibrite colorchecker studio. I think it is best to just use the factory calibated gamut mode on the displays and load the corresponding icc profile for the benq, and for the huion cause there is no icc shipped, i use the original adobergb colorspace icc as the monitor profile that at least the os targets the monitors gamut range and i have no oversaturated colors.
By the way, the second Monitor has a LCD RGB-LED IPS according to the manufacturers support. Doesn’t the SpyderX support this LED technology too? Cause i have the same problem, the red is way to dominant compared to factory!
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use DisplayCAL “visual whitepoint editor”, or even better, since you have a “match to what it looks D65 to you” (display p3 mode, factory calibrated) use it as reference in visual white point… or just set those gains and set white point target “as measured”.
I have listed the reasons why I use ArgyllCMS CLI and not DisplayCAL in the past. But I don’t know how the ArgyllCMS command works. Furthermore, I thought that even if I use a different white point, e.g., adjust the white point to the factory-calibrated white point and then calibrate and profile with the SpyderX, all colors will still be measured incorrectly, because the SpyderX obviously has a large offset between its measurement and the true colors, which affects not only the white point but all colors throughout?
The Spyder X doesn’t support the FPS panel on your display, which is why the resulting white point appears visually off. It’s best not to rely on manufacturer specs or DeltaE “certification” values, as manufacturers themselves admit they come with no guarantees. Trust only the DeltaE values you’ve personally measured using a reliable measurement device.
I understand this now, but i need a okayish solution now and not in 6 month when i have enough money for a new colorimetri, or better for a spectrometer like a calibrite colorchecker studio.
Use answer here:
Reply To: Large white point deviation with SpyderX and presumably incorrect measurement
or
I think it is best to just use the factory calibated gamut mode on the displays and load the corresponding icc profile for the benq
but “corresponding icc profile for the benq” is not Benq driver’s ICC (or macOS autogenerated ICC from Edid), it is the standard profile factory calibration tries to simulate (DisplayP3 icc profile, you can even build it in DisplayCAL synthetic porifle editor)
BUT this solution assumes that factory calibration in grey and gamma is OK. Even with your SpyderX you can verify this, just ignore whitepoint error in HTML report.
Just loot at gamma and a*b* for greys.
DisplayCAL is not “calman”, it will validate greys relative to measured white which is the way to do these things.If grey is not so good (which is unlikely for factory modes, but it may happen) ypu’ll have to go to answer 1 above this quote: relaclibration with alternative whitepoint.
, and for the huion cause there is no icc shipped, i use the original adobergb colorspace icc as the monitor profile that at least the os targets the monitors gamut range and i have no oversaturated colors.
Try to build and ICC profile from EDID (Displaycal file menu), see what manufacturer’ says about device in EDID
By the way, the second Monitor has a LCD RGB-LED IPS according to the manufacturers support.
Unlikely, RGB LED is outdated technology since more than a decade (HP LP2480zx). If it is widegamut and LED it may be GB-LED if is old but not so old (2013-2016), or WLED -PFS/QLED if it is a modern display.
Doesn’t the SpyderX support this LED technology too? Cause i have the same problem, the red is way to dominant compared to factory!
Spyder has only the modes you see. Those reference corrections for the all tehcnologies out there… so it is using the same correction for DIFFERENT technologies.
use DisplayCAL “visual whitepoint editor”, or even better, since you have a “match to what it looks D65 to you” (display p3 mode, factory calibrated) use it as reference in visual white point… or just set those gains and set white point target “as measured”.
I have listed the reasons why I use ArgyllCMS CLI and not DisplayCAL in the past. But I don’t know how the ArgyllCMS command works. Furthermore, I thought that even if I use a different white point, e.g., adjust the white point to the factory-calibrated white point and then calibrate and profile with the SpyderX,
all colors will still be measured incorrectly,
because the SpyderX obviously has a large offset between its measurement and the true colors, which affects not only the white point but all colors throughout?
and?
As long as measured white matches target, it won’t correct it. But it will correct greys to match that white, if there is a deviation. Same for gamma.
Photohop & others won’t care about Display ICC profile saying tht it is not D65 snd color management won’t try to correct it, image to display rendering is whitepoint relative.
That’s why you can use “visual whitepoint editor”.Just aim to alternative whitepoint command line
https://www.argyllcms.com/doc/dispcal.html#wNote:
This assumes that RGB primaries won’t be so off when measured by Spyder + whetever correction you apply, so most measurement error happens in whitepoint where all measurement errors in primaries add.-w An alternative to specifying a white point target in Daylight or Black Body degrees Kevin, is to specify it in chromaticity co-ordinates. This allows the white point to be a color other than one on the Daylight or Black Body. Note that the x,y numbers must be specified as a single string (no space between the numbers and the comma).
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but “corresponding icc profile for the benq” is not Benq driver’s ICC (or macOS autogenerated ICC from Edid), it is the standard profile factory calibration tries to simulate (DisplayP3 icc profile, you can even build it in DisplayCAL synthetic porifle editor)
You mean the gamut color profile icc without correction, that just describes the color gamut? And not with changed primaries for the monitor?
Unlikely, RGB LED is outdated technology since more than a decade (HP LP2480zx). If it is widegamut and LED it may be GB-LED if is old but not so old (2013-2016), or WLED -PFS/QLED if it is a modern display.
The display is in the market since a few month only and has 96% AdobeRGB, 98% DCI-P3! Looks like the support provided wrong data again then, but this time another manufacturer? It is a Huion Kamvas Pro 19. In this case you think it is also a WLED-PFS, likely the same technology than the first display we talket above, the BenQ PD2725U?
I would like to emphasize once again that I contacted support in both cases and was told that the information came from the engineering team and not from the data sheet. I find this very disappointing!
but “corresponding icc profile for the benq” is not Benq driver’s ICC (or macOS autogenerated ICC from Edid), it is the standard profile factory calibration tries to simulate (DisplayP3 icc profile, you can even build it in DisplayCAL synthetic porifle editor)
You mean the gamut color profile icc without correction, that just describes the color gamut? And not with changed primaries for the monitor?
IDNk what you name ” gamut color profile icc without correction”.
Benq DisplayP3 OSD presset “if perfectly & idealy calibrated” is meant to be used color managed with a display ICC profile that is exactly DisplayP3,no factory driver ICC, no macOS EDID generated profile because they will be native gamut and will desaturate green if native gamut green is AdobeRGB.
that “standard” profile should be shpped with your OS or in Argyllcms ref folder. Assign it in OS color management configuration to your display.
If yu change OSD preset ICC profile assignation is no longed valid. You’ll have to find another ICC profile thta matches that OSD preset, like SRGB for example for sRGB OSD preset.
Unlikely, RGB LED is outdated technology since more than a decade (HP LP2480zx). If it is widegamut and LED it may be GB-LED if is old but not so old (2013-2016), or WLED -PFS/QLED if it is a modern display.
The display is in the market since a few month only and has 96% AdobeRGB, 98% DCI-P3!
If it is new, QLED or WLED PFS in AdobeRGB green flavor (depending on main wavelegth of green primary peak you get full AdobeRGB or full P3-Apple- or 9x% P3)
RGB LED was very expensive by tech and QC to get good color unifomrity. That’s why they abandoned it.
Don’t get a spectrometer just for displays. A capable colorimeter + spectral correction is the favored setup. I don’t know what panel type your second display is, but if it’s P3 and released after 2016 then it’s likely PFS and the Spyder X doesn’t support it. If budget is constrained find a used or OEM i1 DisplayPro, they are capable.
You could use spotread ArgyllCMS command to note down the white point that in factory sRGB mode, if it agrees with your eyes. These values can then be used to recreate with custom RGB gains in native mode.
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Don’t get a spectrometer just for displays. A capable colorimeter + spectral correction is the favored setup. I don’t know what panel type your second display is, but if it’s P3 and released after 2016 then it’s likely PFS and the Spyder X doesn’t support it. If budget is constrained find a used or OEM i1 DisplayPro, they are capable.
Here in my country i can buy spyders or the following devices:
– Xrite Calibrite Display Plus HL for arround 300 bucks
– Calibrite ColorChecker Studio (should be a spectrometer if i understand it correct) for arround 500 bucksDo you think it is not worth to never worry again for 200 bucks more, if i understand this topic correctly and this is the case then?
(*) your Spyder hardware may be not “very wrong”. No colorimeter matches std observer. SpyderX and newer is not “that bad”.
The issue here is there is only one built-in correction for all the LED widegamut flavors out there, and spyders are not able to use “distributed corrections” (CCSS), only custom ones (CCMX, matrix) that require an spectriphotometer or similar reference device.
i1d3 is a better hardware yes, but the key is that it accepts distributed corrections.I don’t know why but totally forgot to reply to this part! My SpyderX can really use a CCMX file? Would this help for my issue at the moment? Cause i see some files here for my exact display, maybe published from other nice people:
https://colorimetercorrections.displaycal.net/?get&type=ccmx&manufacturer_id=BNQ&display=BenQ%20PD2725U&instrument=i1%20DisplayPro%2C%20ColorMunki%20Display&html=1
If yes, which, how? and how good is the correction then?
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Ups i think this CCMX files are only for the respective Colorimetri and Display combination, and not just for a certain Display? Then it looks like there is no CCMX for the Spyder 🙁
This whole topic is giving me a headache. It’s too complicated for me to do things that don’t correspond to the normal calibration method, all these workarounds for the white point that you mentioned. Because there is also a big language barrier and gaps in knowledge. I am able to calibrate and/or profile with argyllcms cli in a standard case, but that’s about it.
The whole topic is giving me so much of a headache that since yesterday I’ve been thinking about selling my new drawing tablet and giving up digital drawing and creating!
(*) your Spyder hardware may be not “very wrong”. No colorimeter matches std observer. SpyderX and newer is not “that bad”.
The issue here is there is only one built-in correction for all the LED widegamut flavors out there, and spyders are not able to use “distributed corrections” (CCSS), only custom ones (CCMX, matrix) that require an spectriphotometer or similar reference device.
i1d3 is a better hardware yes, but the key is that it accepts distributed corrections.I don’t know why but totally forgot to reply to this part! My SpyderX can really use a CCMX file?
*IF* you made it. It is valid for YOUR Spyder and YOUR display.
Would this help for my issue at the moment? Cause i see some files here for my exact display, maybe published from other nice people:
https://colorimetercorrections.displaycal.net/?get&type=ccmx&manufacturer_id=BNQ&display=BenQ%20PD2725U&instrument=i1%20DisplayPro%2C%20ColorMunki%20Display&html=1
If yes, which, how? and how good is the correction then?No, because they are not portable. It is not different than your “widegamut led” mode in your Spyder, even worse since it was not made for YOUR colorimeter.
You can assume that Datacolor at its factory used ONE widegamut (from ALL DIFFERENT led widegamut techonolgies) and YOUR colorimeter and compute a matrix correction stored in firmware. It was made for YOUR colorimeter but using an unknown display as a model for ALL fifferent led widegamuts.
Community CCMX maybe made for a display that resembles yours (same model) but the device to correct was not YOURS.
Matrix corrections (CCMX) are not portable. They were computed from info measured by someone else’s colorimeter and a display.CCSS, which i1d3 can use, store only display information. “colorimeter” information about its “raw inaccuracy” is in i1d3 firmware, that’s why we can share them for similar displays.
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CCSS, which i1d3 can use, store only display information. “colorimeter” information about its “raw inaccuracy” is in i1d3 firmware, that’s why we can share them for similar displays.
Everyone here recommends the i1, but to be honest, I don’t want to buy a new device and then have to rely on correction profiles for colorimetri uploaded by others. Not at this price for 300 or more. I’d rather use another device that works without a correction profile, if possible, and spend a little more on it. That way, I won’t have any more headaches!
Does the Calibrite Colorchecker Studio also need to load a correction file for each different display technology, or does it also require ccss or ccmx or something similar? Which device do I need if I simply want to calibrate without having to think about what type of monitor I have and to ensure that everything is completely correct?
Here the product link:
https://calibrite.com/us/product/colorchecker-studio/It’s an spectrophotometer… but a cheap one. It creates corrections for other devices if you take this device measurements as “reference”. Not my recomendation, even for printing.
If you do not want to spend money, and since you have a visual “Valid” (by your judment) white D65 reference… just use the Spyder with an alternative whitepoint as instructed at the start of page 2 (-w param for target whitepoint). That’s all
