I made a tool for applying 3D LUTs to the Windows desktop

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  • #138766

    Dato
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    Thanks for the great program!

    Want to create a guide about creating real HDR 3D Luts for use with DWM_Lut program to calibrate display in hdr mode

    Like I understand built-in patch generator in latest version of DisplayCal cannot output HDR patches for measurement, when switching windows into hdr mode

    You need to use madTPG or Resolve for that

    First select in settings dropdown menu – video 3D LUT for madVR HDR (D65, rec.2020, SMPTE 2084)

    And after that …)

    Need help from users who know details how all this should work?

    #138968

    Gregow
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    What would be the best way to use this tool to achieve something akin to hardware calibration? I know this has been mentioned before but the explanations went a bit over my head.

    Essentially, I would want something like this:

    Display “calibrated” to P3 D65 gamma 2.4.  This is for working with video and stills in Resolve.

    Profile display with LUT applied, for ICC color managed applications, like Photoshop.

    Thus far I’ve tried first profiling the display with calibration settings set to “as measured”, then generating a LUT from that.: P3-D65, relative gamma 2.4 and absolute colorimetric intent.

    Don’t know how to validate this but it seems a bit off. At least, white point is not matching the target in DisplayCals calibration.

    Now the idea would be to once again profile with the LUT applied, with everything set to as measured.

    Is this a bad approach or could it work?

    #138969

    Gregow
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    Upon further testing it seems my approach does not work. Seems to me the profile is applied before the LUT.

    #138979

    Vincent
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    Display “calibrated” to P3 D65 gamma 2.4.  This is for working with video and stills in Resolve.

    Profile display with LUT applied, for ICC color managed applications, like Photoshop.

    Since it is unlikely that your display has a native gamma close to 2.4 and it is more unlekely that your Photoshop work will use colorspaces with TRC gamma 2.4, its easier to:

    -move to biggest gamut preset in your display with access to RGB gains for white
    -calibrate white to D65, gamma 2.2 or the closest one to native, XYZLUT profile
    -after calibration, create a synthetic profile with D65 white, 2.2 gamma (for the example above), your native primaries (from your new profile info)
    -create a LUT3D .cube format, source the new synth profile (step3), destination your custom made profile (step2), make sure to appluy VCGT.
    -set as default display profile the one in step 3
    -open DWMLUT and load your LUT3D (step4).

    Now display should behave like a HW calibrated display to your native primaries, D65 white and gamma 2.2. You should have no banding caused by GPU calibration and have a fairly neutral grey. All color managed apps will color manage to idealized profile described in 3.

    Now for resolve, and assuming that you’ll use it as GUI, full desktop app, you can create a LUT3D that transforms from whatever your vidoe colorspace to the synth profile described in step3.  Depending on what you choose as black in step 3, Resolve LUT3D may deviate a little from measured results in very dark colors.

    If you are going to unplug it from your GPU and attach it to some decklink then you should do the full procedure for Resolve described in DisplayCAL FAQ, not this.

    • This reply was modified 6 months, 4 weeks ago by Vincent.
    #138982

    Gregow
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    Display “calibrated” to P3 D65 gamma 2.4.  This is for working with video and stills in Resolve.

    Profile display with LUT applied, for ICC color managed applications, like Photoshop.

    Since it is unlikely that your display has a native gamma close to 2.4 and it is more unlekely that your Photoshop work will use colorspaces with TRC gamma 2.4, its easier to:

    -move to biggest gamut preset in your display with access to RGB gains for white
    -calibrate white to D65, gamma 2.2 or the closest one to native, XYZLUT profile
    -after calibration, create a synthetic profile with D65 white, 2.2 gamma (for the example above), your native primaries (from your new profile info)
    -create a LUT3D .cube format, source the new synth profile (step3), destination your custom made profile (step2), make sure to appluy VCGT.
    -set as default display profile the one in step 3
    -open DWMLUT and load your LUT3D (step4).

    Now display should behave like a HW calibrated display to your native primaries, D65 white and gamma 2.2. You should have no banding caused by GPU calibration and have a fairly neutral grey. All color managed apps will color manage to idealized profile described in 3.

    Now for resolve, and assuming that you’ll use it as GUI, full desktop app, you can create a LUT3D that transforms from whatever your vidoe colorspace to the synth profile described in step3.  Depending on what you choose as black in step 3, Resolve LUT3D may deviate a little from measured results in very dark colors.

    If you are going to unplug it from your GPU and attach it to some decklink then you should do the full procedure for Resolve described in DisplayCAL FAQ, not this.

    What is the native gamma? I have three settings: 2.0, 2.2 and 2.5. The 2.5 setting has the most stable tracking with mid grey at 2.4.

    My current workflow for still images is to export from Resolve to make the final conversion in Photoshop. In Photoshop, that’s applying the display profile to the image – so that it matches what I see in Resolve – and then converting to sRGB or Image P3.

    Anyway, a few questions:

    Is it necessary for this to work to calibrate white point and gamma? Getting the white point in line with the RGB controls will lower the contrast and reduce the gamut (display is getting old).

    In the synthetic profile, should I use a D65 white point or the measured white point of the display? I assume the latter, but best to double check that I got it right.

    Is 100% black point offset and no BPC the right way to go?

    Thanks for your help, I appreciate it.

    #138983

    Vincent
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    #138979 is a general recipe

    If by chance OSD setting “gamma 2.5” gives you more neutral grey or it is better behaved than others you can use it.
    Same for alternative whitepoints… it’s up to you but if you go for alt white point and want to keep that white all LUT3D must be relative colorimetric or use as source profile a modified version with your alt white point.

    Regarding profile usually you want to simulate an idealized (matrix) display with true neutral grey, and infinite contrast…. that’s the kind of profile you’ll get at default settings with most HW calibration software from monitor vendor. If you want other thing, like actual black level then create the synth profile with actual display’s black level.

    I mean, for a typical widegamut IPS with native contrast ~1000:1,  lowered to ~920:1 after RGB gains to get D65 and typical native gamma ~2.2 or sRGB-like and a display with no HW calibration or a display that has a HW calibration app with lots of deficiencies (lack of proper colorimeter corrections, bad grey range after calibration…you know), I’ll go for #138979 as is.
    If your display is far worse that a typical IPS display modify that recipe at your will to fit your needs.

    #138988

    Gregow
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    Thanks Vincet, I’ll give it a try after a bit of shut eye. What’s the proper way of verifying this afterwards?

    #138989

    Vincent
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    Measurement report. You should have the synth profile as display profile in OS before.

    #138991

    Gregow
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    Measurement report. You should have the synth profile as display profile in OS before.

    Use simulation profile unchecked? Or maybe doesn’t matter as DisplayCal isn’t handling any profile or vcgt.

    Anyway, decided to start with gamma 2.2 and then make a gamma 2.4 profile, to compare them later (takes around an hour to profile so it’s a bit slow).

    Accuracy seems very good so far, but I got some banding (especially in the darks) that I really don’t like.

    #138992

    Gregow
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    For Resolve, did you mean to create a LUT that goes from, say, P3-D65 gamma 2.4 (source) to synthetic profile (destination)?

    #139003

    Vincent
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    Measurement report. You should have the synth profile as display profile in OS before.

    Use simulation profile unchecked? Or maybe doesn’t matter as DisplayCal isn’t handling any profile or vcgt.

    All unchecked. You are actually simulation something that is published as current display profile, so just verify if display behaves like that ICC profile.

    Anyway, decided to start with gamma 2.2 and then make a gamma 2.4 profile, to compare them later (takes around an hour to profile so it’s a bit slow).

    Accuracy seems very good so far, but I got some banding (especially in the darks) that I really don’t like.

    #139004

    Vincent
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    For Resolve, did you mean to create a LUT that goes from, say, P3-D65 gamma 2.4 (source) to synthetic profile (destination)?

    IDNK what is teh colospace of your video files. Typical scenario is Rec709 footage displayed in an AdobeRGB/P3 widegamut display. In that sample scenario, Rec709 g2.4 as source , display profile as destination.
    Remember that “display profile” should be a profile that describes display in its CURRENT situation and thar includes the effect of DWMLUT LUT3D active (= simulated colorspace by LUT3D)

    #139212

    kaneda
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    Hello.

    Since you mention the INNOCN M2V, what you think about the 32M2V for photo/video, I not a pro, also I want to get a calibrator, which one I should get for this monitor?

    This is all new for me, I order the 32 version last week……

    Thank you.

    #139682

    JC-RFC
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    Nooj wrote:How to turn off automatically dwm_lut when madVR is playing?
    You can’t. You have to do it manually each time.

    I presume this could be scripted when your madvr player is called.

    eg. Zoomplayer has a run before playing option that you could call DwmLutGUI.exe -disable.

    It also has an option for run after playback to which you could add: DwmLutGUI.exe -apply

    Other players have similar options, and otherwise you could write your own script to disable, call video player, enable using batch, vbscript etc.

    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by JC-RFC.
    #139811

    mbze430
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    I have a question regarding DWMLUT.  I already have a 3DLUT made using the “Creating a 3D LUT for the GUI color viewer” Resolve workflow.

    using this part:

    The “Resolve” preset is set up to not use iterative gray balance calibration, but as we are going to create a profile that will also be installed to the operating system, you may want to enable it. Set calibration tone curve on the “Calibration” tab from “As measured” to “Rec. 1886” (or another desired curve). Note that this setting does not influence the 3D LUT tone curve, which you can adjust in the next step.
    IMPORTANT If you have opted to do iterative gray balance calibration, enable advanced options in the “Options” menu, then go to the “3D LUT” tab and disable “Apply calibration (vcgt)”. This is very important because while Resolve does not make use of the display ICC profile, it’s user interface is still affected by the 1D calibration of the profile we’re going to install later, so applying it to the 3D LUT would result in the calibration being applied twice.

    If I used that method to create the 3D LUT file with the tone curve all set and created an 1D LUT file as well.  Can I still be able to use that same LUT with DWMLUT or DWMLUT by-pass the WCS in Windows and not care about the ICC profile that it is set to?  In which case I would need to create a different 3D LUT?

    • This reply was modified 5 months ago by mbze430.
    • This reply was modified 5 months ago by mbze430.
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