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  • #140964

    Vincent
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    With “Use my settings” unchecked, I see “Add…” in the lower left corner (that’s an elevated button).
    With “Use my settings” checked, as with Ben, my profile disappears and the “Add…” button in the lower left is no longer elevated.
    I think the elevated call changes this for the system and the non-elevated call (“Use my settings” checked) just changes them for me.

    Win \ control panel \ color management \ Devices, check use my configuration for that display, Add profiles, no admin privileges.
    Next profiles creted by display call will add automatically

    Could that be the case? I’m OK to try the DisplayCAL profile for the whole system. Now I’m “re-confused” 😉 because Vincent tells me that my profile uses the wrong settings????? What do I do to create a better / good profile then? Your explanation is a bit cryptic to me (apologies, I’m not experienced here).

    As a general rule using XYZLUT profiles for system wide color management is an error IF display behaves well. This is due to limited presicion in computations on each app color management engine. XYZLUT profiles use 3 indpeendent TRC curves and that is likely to cause coloration in grey gradients color managed even if no color managed it looks amooth & neutral.
    IF display behaves in a good way, best to try single curve + matrix profile + black point compensation.

    3Dmesh profiles (XYZLUT) are interesting for creating LUT3D for display, since it captures actual behavior, or to characterize as RGB devices a printer or such.

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 2 days ago by Vincent.
    #140966

    TML59
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    Yep, but this is what Vincent wrote about my xyzlt+matrix profile… I bolded his comment

    ““32UHD144 #1 2023-08-04 14-51 2.2 F-S XYZLUT+MTX.icm” custom profile by DisplayCAL with grey calibration. Wrong settings BTW (better start with medium speed or slower, matrix + single curve, BPC).

    #140968

    Ben
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    Yes he said to use a matrix single curve ,BPC.     It really is your choice what to use.   I get 500 less contrast with BPC.    A good display would not do that.    High quality matrix with singe curve is not long at all to calibrate.     The more patches the better on some displays.    A good display only needs the least patches.    You test and see what works.    Your info is very little.    What display?   What is your plan to use calibration?    I only worry about non color managed apps.   Browsers are color managed and I hope that streaming from browser is color managed.   I can not tell if its off.     My hardware report is lousy but color managed it passed nominal.

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    #140972

    TML59
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    Sorry, I’m using a Corsair XENEON 32UHD144 screen (IPS with Quantum Dot Technology, 10bit RGB, Peak Brightness 350 nit (SDR) / 600 nit (HDR), VESA DisplayHDR 60 certification, Color Gamut (CIE 1976) 98% (DCI-P3), 100% (AdobeRGB), 100% (sRGB))

    #140974

    Ben
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    Really Nice.    I do not think you will see a difference in regular content.   The non display cal probably came with it.    You should verify the display before calibrating with a verification report.  Learning display cal is a lot.

    LCD quantum dot profile ?    I do not know which profile to use for TML59.     Just make sure your  display instrument correction is right.   On the display and instrument screen there is a link to explain the screen types.

    #140976

    TML59
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    Thanks Ben. I used a Spyder and DisplayCAL to calibrate my screen, so my assumption is that the calibrated version is (somewhat) better than the uncalibrated default.
    What is weird, is that Calibrilla STILL shows basically linear lines for RGB, but maybe that’s because the correction is small? I DO see that the values for RG and B are similar but not identical (see attachment).

    All of this started in another forum (for Lightroom), as I’m seeing major differences between Library and Develop mode for the same photo’s. What’s even more weird is that if I view a photo (exported from Lightroom) in Windows, the view is significantly different if I e.g. use MS Paint vs MS Photo (with MS Paint matching the LR Develop view). Very clear if I open both apps to show the same photo on the same screen!
    Discussion in that forum suggested color profiles causing this (and indicating that maybe MS Paint uses the profile and MS Phot does not, I cannot find any information for that to date however…) and that’s what brought me to this forum. Now that I have the right (calibrated) profile loaded (well… I’m still not sure of that as Calibrilla doesn’t show that name), I still see the differences VERY vividly.

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    #140978

    Vincent
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    Sorry, I’m using a Corsair XENEON 32UHD144 screen (IPS with Quantum Dot Technology, 10bit RGB, Peak Brightness 350 nit (SDR) / 600 nit (HDR), VESA DisplayHDR 60 certification, Color Gamut (CIE 1976) 98% (DCI-P3), 100% (AdobeRGB), 100% (sRGB))

    If it is actually a QD and there is no user made CCSS for that display try one of the CCSS for AdobeRGB QD displays from Asus (community database), IF you had an i1d3 colorimeter, they shoudl be close.

    Calibrite Display Pro HL on Amazon  
    Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

    #140979

    Vincent
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    Thanks Ben. I used a Spyder and DisplayCAL to calibrate my screen, so my assumption is that the calibrated version is (somewhat) better than the uncalibrated default.

    Depending on Spyder model that won’t be the case. SPyder 3/4/5are paperweights.
    Spyder X has reasobable HW but lacks of customizable distributed colorimeter corrections… so using Wide LED mode in DisplayCAL or Datacolor software it MAY suggets you to correct RGB gains in monitor to a value that does not look as “white” as D65 should be (for typical D65 calibration).
    So if you have these issues with suggested RGB gains by an SPyderX, match visually to a reference display that is and looks as actual D65.

    Also correction grayscale may cause additional problems like banding, That’s suually GPU fault, not SpyderX’s

    All of this started in another forum (for Lightroom), as I’m seeing major differences between Library and Develop mode for the same photo’s. What’s even more weird is that if I view a photo (exported from Lightroom) in Windows,

    Library => AFAIK no dither
    Develop => Dither, hence potentially bandless

    the view is significantly different if I e.g. use MS Paint vs MS Photo (with MS Paint matching the LR Develop view). Very clear if I open both apps to show the same photo on the same screen!

    Those apps are not color managed (not sure about w11 Photo), hence unless exported image is sRGB and display matched exactly sRGB they will render wrong colors. Old windows viewer while not in fullscreen is somehow color managed.

    You cannot use those apps on a wdegamut display. They are not reliable.

    Discussion in that forum suggested color profiles causing this (and indicating that maybe MS Paint uses the profile and MS Phot does not, I cannot find any information for that to date however…) and that’s what brought me to this forum. Now that I have the right (calibrated) profile loaded (well… I’m still not sure of that as Calibrilla doesn’t show that name), I still see the differences VERY vividly.

    Read a webinar about color management.

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 1 day ago by Vincent.

    SpyderX Pro on Amazon  
    Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

    #140985

    Ben
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    What mode do you use on the display?   This might tell if color correction is working.  https://www.wide-gamut.com/test

    https://www.color.org/index.xalter    Resources and getting started is good.   The FAQs do give how to check your profile.  Understanding the words is another thing.

    #140986

    TML59
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    Does your monitor support ICC colour profiles? > Yes
    Can your monitor display a wide colour gamut? > Yes
    How far from sRGB is your display color gamut? ? I do see differences
    (and yes, if I switch to HDR, it works too)
    On the “Image SDR” page the sRGB colors are significantly less vivid than the “Display P3” colors

    Thanks for the website with more info, I’ll read through that and I’m sure that I’ll learn more (note that w.r.t. color science, I have a reasonable background as I did spectroscopy in an earlier life. Even developed color analyzers for certain products in the industry where I worked. I know, that’s very different from color profiling on computers… just trying to explain that I do have some background ;-))

    #140994

    TML59
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    I checked the color differences and they are now gone :-)…. Seems that setting the DisplayCAL profile in Windows did the trick for me. Don’t ask if I understand that but it looks like somehow DisplayCAL tells Windows to use it’s profile sometimes but Apps seem to also read that from Windows. Now that both are the same the problems are gone.

    Thanks again for your patience and all the help and suggestions: very much appreciated indeed!

    #140999

    Ben
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    Here is a bonus video. lol   Steeling from reddit.  https://youtu.be/FTKP0Y9MVus?feature=shared   .   Color dont matter much.  Its the vectors.   And getting Sat and lumnace right at the  no saturation points at any brightness.   Glad the color decoder knows how for non coor managed apps.    The meter and profile is for color managed apps.

    #141004

    TML59
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    Thanks. That’s a bit of a shortcut of course. Calibrating the screen should make representation on screen more natural (depending on the ambient light etc. yes). Often colors are too bright, some (cheaper) brands might have a color haze. When I would edit a photo (in Lightroom, which is what I use) and my screen would be non-calibrated and e.g. too blue, my perception is just that, and I would edit the blue out a bit. If in five years or so, I’d buy a better screen, it will then look as if all my photo’s lack blue color… That’s what I’d like to avoid.
    And, as I’m sure you all know this, if I send picture to others (I’m not a professional or even close to that) they might think my colors are off. But if I work on a calibrated screen, chances are high that the problem is on the receiving end then.
    And then there’s the problem with printers (but I don’t print too much).
    I think the overall problem will be getting smaller over time as more and more screens will get better (calibrated) color representations.
    And yes, aside from the right colors, I don’t disagree that what a person will see first is luminance and saturation.

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