Basic Calibration help for a total newb

Home Forums Help and Support Basic Calibration help for a total newb

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 28 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #22676

    Samskihero
    Participant
    • Offline

    Hey Everyone, the past 5 days I’ve been trying to calibrate my monitors and learning about color calibration (trying to get the best calibration as I don’t trust the calibration I’ve been getting) and I’ve soaked up so much information & misinformation from posts from forums along the way that my brain is now fried I’m more lost than ever further from getting things right and at a point, I just want to get it over with haha!

    I need two calibrations

    • One for photos editing Photoshop, LightRoom, Design work > Always intending for output to WEB not PRINT
    • One more for video REC709 for Davinci Resolve (Not a video lut) > Always intending for output to WEB, not Broadcast/TV

    Specs

    I have an Xrite i1 Display, and a VA Panel I guess LCD White (Samsung LC27JG50QQUXEN 27-Inch WQHD Monitor)

    I’m simply trying to get the best out of what I’ve got, The colors from my current calibrations look better but I’m really struggling with Gamma. This isn’t rocket science but and with all the info I’ve sucked up it feels like it’s a world I’m not apart of so looking to get this over with hehe!

    Any help would save me days more work lol!

    #22691

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    If you want help, its better to detail what you did and what you get. For example:

    -screenshots of each DisplayCAL “tab” to see which configuration & settings you choose
    -attach profile, so people can inspect it: gamut, white, TRC, spot some user made misconfiguration from calibration curves…
    -a verification report of display profile against calibration, to see calibration results (gamma , white, range) and if profile matches that calibration

    Otherwise… it is extremely difficult to help you.

    If that monitor is a common sRGB LED monitor (IDNK), basic setup works fine for most people:
    -all to defaults
    -White LED IPS LG samsung etc colorimeter correction for i1displaypro (if you own that)
    -calibration speed medium or slow (IDNK how goor or bad your monitor is, slow is 30min)
    -6500K + daylight, gamma 2.2, black 6 white level as measured (choose whatever brightness you want while fixing white point)
    -single curve + matrix profile & black point compensation
    Then validate, share your profiel & report results.

    i1Display Pro on Amazon  
    Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

    #22757

    Samskihero
    Participant
    • Offline

    Hey Vincent thanks for you’re response!

    So I went in for calibration at D65, Gamma 2.2

    I couldn’t find “Black 6” thing you mentioned or “single + curve matrix profile & Black compensation”

    The calibration seems fine but Opinions are good

    But here is the profile

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks ago by Samskihero.
    Attachments:
    You must be logged in to view attached files.
    #22777

    S Simeonov
    Participant
    • Offline

    -single curve + matrix profile & black point compensation

    Vincent, I’m wondering about the single curve + matrix profile and the black point compensation, isn’t XYZ LUT+matrix the default and more accurate profile type?

    #22778

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    Hey Vincent thanks for you’re response!

    So I went in for calibration at D65, Gamma 2.2

    I couldn’t find “Black 6” thing you mentioned or “single + curve matrix profile & Black compensation”

    6 = &, a typo, my fault.

    But here is the profile

    Seems fine, after calibration 3 independent TRC in your settings (XYZLUT) make a match.

    #22779

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    -single curve + matrix profile & black point compensation

    Vincent, I’m wondering about the single curve + matrix profile and the black point compensation, isn’t XYZ LUT+matrix the default and more accurate profile type?

    Yes.

    But some color managed apps work in a very limited precision. If you use a profile type with 3 independent TRC and they do not mach, color manaed apps will try to correct it when showing an image with typical neutral TRC colorspace like sRGB, AdobeRGB and such. When these tasks are done with low precision or with simple trunctation when you need to sent it wo screen you may end with slight green or pink cast due to rounding errors, even if your calibration, visually, looks neutral.

    So, yes, XYZLUT is more accurate but if you experience those issues you *may* want to choose a simplified profile type. Most HW cal software from vendor sets that type of simplified profile by default (or close variations), trusting that their HW cal will be accurate enough to de described with taht kind of simplified profile (to get a match between profile & display upon verification).

    For example, for making a LUT3D you’ll want the accurate one, for working with Illustrator or Indesign in a well behaved display you may want 1TRC profile.

    #22783

    S Simeonov
    Participant
    • Offline

    I’m on Dell aw3420dw, and I’m trying to find the “sweet spot” for my calibrations – which are for windows, firefox, photoshop, illustrator, ifranview etc. I’m making also another calibration for madvr 3dlut. So I’m kinda puzzled over what type of profile to choose: xyz lut+matrix, curves+matrix or single curve+matrix…

    #22785

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    I’m on Dell aw3420dw, and I’m trying to find the “sweet spot” for my calibrations – which are for windows, firefox, photoshop, illustrator, ifranview etc. I’m making also another calibration for madvr 3dlut. So I’m kinda puzzled over what type of profile to choose: xyz lut+matrix, curves+matrix or single curve+matrix…

    Open Photoshop,  new 1000×1000 sRGB 8 bit image (same test later with 16bit). Choose gradient tool, try to make a 0 degree left to right black to white gradient. Check for those issues. Then try the same with 1xTRC (3xTRC equal) profile.

    It depends on monitor behavior & quality, but if your DisplayCAL GPU calibration grants you smooth gradients without banding with no color management (lagom’s gradient without color management), then 1xTRC profile is very likely to show the less issues in color managed apps. Illustrator is more prone to show these issues than Photoshop, try the same custom gradient task in Illustrator, then choose the one that fits better your needs.

    Of couse a good monitor profiled with XYZLUT and 3 TRC where those TRC mach each other should look as good a 1xTRC matrix profile.
    Also you can get variations like 1TRC matrix profile with actual blackpoint brightness as seeing in some vendor HW calibration software.

    #22786

    S Simeonov
    Participant
    • Offline

    I get banding in the gradients on 8 bit and 16 bit…

    #22788

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    It’s expected if Photoshop truncates color data to 8bit when sending to screen. 16bit 1000×1000 black to white gradient should show less issues in most monitors.
    ACR/LR/CaptureOne does the same but they use dithering so if there is no banding on MS Paint due to GPU limitations, they won’t show it color managed.
    For example, in Photoshop with your custom gradient showing bands, then open ACR filter (shit+ctrl+a), banding should be gone : image data -> color management at high precision -> dithering to 8bit -> GPU calibration (supposed to do not suffer banding) -> 8bit-10bit link to display.
    Try ACR that way with “10bit test gradient.psd”… bands are gone, ther was no need for 10bit pipeline end to end and expensive Quadro/FirePro cards all these years.
    Same happens with madVR, smooth color managed gradients.

    IMHO this is the way to go, GPU independent smooth rendering, instead of 10bit openGL with HW limitations (maket segmentation) solutions that Photoshop offers.

    #22789

    S Simeonov
    Participant
    • Offline

    I don’t have the options in ACR, but anyway, I’m still confused abaout the profile type selection. Also I’m getting black crush with 2.2 gamma and 100% BOO, also with 3dlut gamma 2.4 100% BOO.

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 6 days ago by S Simeonov.
    #22793

    Samskihero
    Participant
    • Offline

    Thank you VIncent

    Sadly I’m having another issue regarding Lightroom my Black level is totally busted using these profiles, If I launch LR the black becomes like a shade of dark grey neon it’s just strange, booting LR with just a SRGB profile from windows it’s fine

    From what I’ve read “LR is very finiky about the type of display profile, which should be ICC Version 2 (not 4) and Matrix type (not LUT)”

    But this is all beyond me as is, any suggestions?

    #22794

    Samskihero
    Participant
    • Offline

    I also enabled advanced mode which is where I found many useful settings like the SIngle curve, I redid a calibration to see if that fixed my black level on LR but didn’t fix it

    #22795

    Samskihero
    Participant
    • Offline

    I also gave this a little go for fun and Disappointed to see all my profiles (XYZ and 1 curve matrix) all have bad banding 8-bit and 16-bit

    But not the standard sRGB profile in windows looks great, I’m completely overwhelmed by all this at this point no idea how to fix LR gamma with my profiles, my calibrations are just worse than default

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 6 days ago by Samskihero.
    #22797

    Vincent
    Participant
    • Offline

    sRGB profile on windows attached as default display profile should do:
    -clear any previous GPU calibration
    -set sRGB RGB primaries like in a matrix profile
    -set some TRC as display profile when color managed apps ask about it, likely to be sRGB TRC but since there are a lot of so called sRGB profiles IDNK which one you chose, with 0input match 0 brightness output (“infinite contrast”, sort of BPC)

    If that looks fine on your LR setup, try to replicate it, step by step, but with a GPU calibration

    1-first of all make sure that GPU calibration from your profile does not cause bading in non color managed aps: get Lagom’s grey gradient, download PNG, open in MS paint. If there is banding with CPU calibration loaded, then you may have some conflict with LUT loaders: windows, 3rd party like Xrite/basiccolor, DisplayCAL. Disable all of them but DisplayCAL one. Then reboot. Try again opening that gradient in Paint. If banding is gone proceed with step 2, otherwise you have a serious problem with you GPU HW capabilities or drivers. On an AMD card it should not happen. On an intel iGPU it is almost granted to happen and you can do nothing. On an nvidia some people solved it , at least partially in some setups by using 10bpc displayport link to display (if supported by display) or dithering using registry tricks, you may look for that stuff in this forum (enabling dithering on registry on nvidias).
    If this cannot be solved in your GPU, you won’t get rid from banding unless you buy a better suited GPU (AMD is the safest choice IMHO) or use some monitor with HW calibration (so GPU doe snot need to store non linear calibration). Useless to go to step 2 unless this get fixed. Try lagom gradient PNG opened with MS paint an a calibration loaded (the profile you attached earlier)

    2- Once you are certain that even with a GPU calibration loaded you do not suffer banding in a non color managed app like MS paint an lagom gradient, you need to “store” that calibration in a profile close to what you report as “smooth without issues in LR”. That kind of profile is “single curve + matrix” profile type with Black point compensation (BPC) enabled. This is equal to RGB primaries within a matrix, TRC curves that store “perfectly neutral” grey and 0 input=0 output (BPC).
    I’m using one of these displaycal-made simple display profiles right now on LR classic 7.5 (DEVELOP module), also with a GPU calibration loaded into my old “not firepro” AMD, bandless lagom gradient on Paint and Edge… and it causes no issues and I can even see a perfectly smooth “10bit gradient.tiff”. Same if I open them with ACR filter in Photoshop (=render close to or equal to LR’s develop module). Same with Capture One 20.0.2, latest version.
    Unless there is a bug in latest versions of Adobe software there cannot be any banding issue with those simple profiles if GPU calibration is bandless & smooth. Hence the need to test step 1 and be sure that it goes smooth

    • This reply was modified 1 week, 6 days ago by Vincent.
    • This reply was modified 1 week, 6 days ago by Vincent.
    • This reply was modified 1 week, 6 days ago by Vincent.
Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 28 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.

Log in or Register

Display Calibration and Characterization powered by ArgyllCMS